Brexit And EU rules on 90 day rule - Page 3

Well said Daio

Ok, let me ask a slightly different question … why now?  Why the sudden demand for 180 days?  Brits have NEVER been allowed longer than 90 days without registering as resident.

Those that claim that their enjoyment of the premises has been curtailed because NOW they can only spend 90 days are fooling themselves - anyone who stayed longer than 90 days pre-Brexit without registering as resident was breaking the law … so why all of a sudden now the desire for longer? Is it because breaking the law now carries stiffer penalties than it did before Brexit?  ergo, try and change a law that has stood the same for years.

If the request for longer is predicated on that, it’s not going to get far. “When we broke the law before, nobody seemed to mind so much - now they do, so change the law please”

Hi Dario

I go back to your (why now) Question?

When i started this conversation,i  was only referring to comments made by a Spanish tax expert in the EWN that the EU could be breaking its own laws.

Then L181SKY followed that up with comments made by a regional official  up in Valencia that the 90 day rule being imposed on UK none residents was starting to cost Spain money

These are statements made by EU/Spanish citizens going about their daily work not  myself orL181SKY trying to change EU law.

In the end it will come down to one thing  MONEY

It will indeed - with regards the EWN, take anything they print with a pinch of salt - they are not above stirring the pot by printing utterly fictitious articles.  I say that because the “infringement of human rights” argument fails miserably when it meets the “but you’ve ONLY ever been allowed 90 days as a non resident” argument.  The “infringement of human rights” was at very best a very very very long shot and would be more about raising someone’s profile than actually winning it.

That I fear is the case with Puig as well.  Having raised this and made a bit of a noise, he’s raised his profile, seen to be doing something … he’s not up for re-election in the next year or so is he?  Gods I’m becoming cynical.

Yes, it will be about money.  It will also be about political capital and what can be gained from that.  For the first time last year, French tourists outnumbered British.  Yes, there was a decline in British numbers - but there was also an increase in French.

Finally, I have seen elsewhere the hollow threat that if not granted 180 days, some Brits will “sell up” their properties and leave Spain.  That’ll show Spain, right?

Actually, no.  If a property sells, then there is obviously a buyer which means more taxes paid to Spain.  And what if the buyer is a full time resident? Then that means income from the new owner throughout the year in terms of (more) electricity, food, petrol for vehicle, servicing etc etc etc.  the threat of “selling up” if Spain doesn’t give 180 days straight is indeed a hollow one - the only one that loses is the person that sells their holiday home.  Spain still wins.

Hi Dario

I have not made any threats to sell up,i still enjoy my visits here 30/60 or 90days.

Never suggested you had made those threats - only that I’ve seen them elsewhere 

This thread todate suggests:-

1. European Weekly News prints fiction only regarding desired increase of the amount of time Brits spend in Spain.

2. Spain not bending to hearsay being propagated by Brits hoping they'll be allowed stay beyond legal time.

3. It's not all about money. Spain misses the Brits who spend one or two weeks here in high summer season (Covid being the main cause of this problem), but doesn't miss the spend from Brits who spend the winter/spring months.

4. UK politicians remaining quiet and appearing to hope people will forget the lies politically propagated during the referendum period.

5. Brits are no nearer to having their time in Spain extended

6. Brits under the radar hope they can remain under the radar.

7. Belgian, French, Dutch, Nordic people slowly but surely are replacing Brits. 

If Brits in Spain and in the UK fail to hassle their elected representatives regarding extending their legal time spent in Spain it's akin to waiting to be engulfed in more worry, stress, etc. And all this was made in Britain and brought to you  through Brexit the gift that keeps on giving.

Newsflash Guys! The Tories in the UK caused all this, not the politicians in Spain.

Newsflash 2:- The supporters regarding Brexit on this forum have all gone to ground. I'd love to hear them arguing here again. 

This post seems to be going on much too long and is getting tedious.

The only real difference since Brexit is that of only 90 days in 180 which still allows 180 days  year but not consecutively.

Before that you could NOT spend more than 182.5 days (183 in a leap year) without becoming a Tax resident  with all that implied regarding world wide income. This seems to have been ignored by most of those complaining on here. 

I wonder how many of those complainants formed part of the "black economy" , keeping below the parapet in both the uk and spain which is probavly why they cannot meet the fincial rules now!

Where we are is a fact of life and is VERY unlikely to change in the future unless the whole Schengen block changes. I am afraid that many Btits took advantage of the fact that the rule was not enforced in the past. It was STILL a rule

Everyone will now have to get a residencia or a Long term Visaa if they want to spend longer. They cannot have it both ways!

To get back to the initial post, I think it is extremely unlikely that the a European Convention on Human Rights can be used in this way.  I practised as a lawyer for many years dealing with rights of access to education, health and social care - all areas which brought in aspects of human rights.  What many commentators fail to understand is that human rights nearly always allow governments to carry out a balancing exercise - the only absolute rights we have are freedom from torture and freedom from slavery. Instead we hear the term being used whenever something happens that we don’t like, regardless of whether there is a claim in law.  That is not to say human rights don’t exist and the legislation is not useful - it just doesn’t apply to the vast majority of cases, regardless of what people might think. 

I feel for people who have been adversely affected by this in many ways unforeseen consequence of Brexit, and I realise that I am privileged as an honorary Paddy, but it doesn’t help to raise people’s hopes too much.

I too feel for people regarding Brexit, but in no way, shape or form were these difficulties or cons“unforeseen”.